It's not one of the producers you mentioned, but sometime in 2018 or 2019, I impulse-bought Domaine des Baumard's Clos du Papillon (dated 2016, I think). I knew nothing about the contrasting Chenin styles of Loire sub-areas at the time, and had probably never heard of Savennières, much less its micro-appelations. I rarely even buy French whites to begin with. But somehow I had a hunch.
It didn't get opened until six months into the pandemic, on an occasion (under otherwise stressful conditions) that marked the first time I'd seen family since the pandemic began. It was life-affirmingly amazing and one of the few highlights of that fraught year.
I've yet to encounter Baumard in a brick-and-mortar again, but by chance I already have that very Domaine aux Moines in my fridge, waiting to be indulged.
The very one. In the fridge, for at least a few months now. I think it was the first Savennières of any sort I'd encountered on a store shelf since that Clos du Papillon. Awaiting summer and/or "the right occasion" and/or the kick-in-the-pants from this post.
This is a great wine that ages really well. If you want a special dessert-styled wine go for their Quarts de Chaume. I had a case of the ‘71 that I finished off around 2015. The bottles that were sound ( it came from a questionable previous owner through auction ) were some of the most sublime sweet wines I’ve ever had!
Wow, thank you for the recommendation! Internet searches (for the Clos du Papillon, at least) tend to suggest their distribution still exists, though Massachusetts makes shipping more complicated than most states so I've never developed an online-ordering habit. Meanwhile, the store where I first bought it closed its urban location during the pandemic; I'm rarely in the suburbs.
But I absolutely already have mapped out Baumard's distance from the Savennières train station, along with a few other producers on both sides of the river, and have nudged that part of the world up the post-COVID travel list. So I'll be adding "investigate their sweet offerings" to my radar.
It’s a great region to visit. Make sure to get to Vouvray & Montlouis ( right across the river from each other ). I’m sure there are some great tasting rooms. Not sure if Huet offers a tour but their cellars are amazing with old vintages to die for just stacked up! Not sure if there’s as much old stock left since the family sold the domaine a whole back. I heard the main interest of the wealthy buyer from Asia was to get his hands on all the old bottles for himself & friends. We were lucky. The legendary Noel Pinguet, son-in-law of the even more legendary Gaston Huet, and winemaker for almost 40 years, spent an entire day with us tasting old vintages, touring vineyards & crawling through the cellars as we had a mutual winemaker friend that is close with both of us and set it up. When the day ended, Noel handed my wife & I over to an assistant and brought us into a special buyer’s room and said to the assistant “they’re cleared to buy anything they want to!” This was in 2007 and vintages back yo the 1920s were staring us in the face!
As I'm sure you can tell, I'm no expert in the region, but my encounters with Vouvray have only been... fine. There really might be some subjective attribute of the one sub-region that speaks to me in a way others won't. But I appreciate the guidance; it's already novel that I'd consider a trip to a white wine-specific area, so of course I'd want to see some breadth of geography and taste some compare-and-contrast.
On Savennieres, specifically Nicolas Joly’s Coulee de Serrant.
I can remember my first (and only) trip to the property with my former wife back in 1992 or 93.
The importer at that time was anxious for someone from Sherry-Lehmann (the OLD Sherry-Lehmann!) to visit the property to give a boost to their sales.
Nicolas was the perfect host, but we got the distinct impression that after a quiet night in Angers we had been transported into another dimension.
The opportunity to taste older vintages removed some of the mystery of that wonderful but challenging wine at its peak, but the most memorable thing about that day were the surroundings.
Normal flowering plants after M. Joly had applied his biodynamic magic were gigantic.
Congrats on bringing these to your readers attention , if they weren’t already ). Savenieres makes tremendous wines. I’m sure you’ve heard Nicolas Joly speak. He is one of the most passionate winegrowers I’ve ever met. His belief in biodynamic farming is unwavering to say the least.
I'll have to start exploring Loire wines. Great newsletter. However, one thing hits a nerve with me: the “godfather of biodynamic viticulture.” Biodynamics is a fringe, pseudoscientific theory of agriculture invented by a clairvoyant with no farming experience. I can't support anti-science nonsense, and I don't like it being promoted. As Brian Dunning said, "Essentially, we're talking about witchcraft and sorcery being employed as a modern farming tool." I realize that otherwise mentally competent adults can believe in quirky things, but biodynamics should have all our crap detectors pinned in the red. https://skeptoid.com/episodes/4026
Eh, the way I feel about biodynamic farming is that it forces the winegrower to be constantly out in the vineyard and hyperfocused on everything, so that has to be a good thing. So who cares whether they believe in something that other people see as "witchcraft"? As long as they're hands-on in the vineyard and growing organically. Also, I would say the quality-to-duds percentage of biodynamic wines I drink is much higher than conventional farming, so whether or not it's scientifically sound, the people following it often make better wines.
I’ve always said something similar. Biodynamic winemakers spend a lot of time in the vineyard. I’m pretty close friends with Olivier Humbrecht and I’ve never seen a winemaker as conscientious in the vineyards and as hands off in the winery as he is and he puts out great wines of terroir. He’s very scientific in his approach ( like Noel Pinguet was when he had the reigns at Domaine Huet in Vouvray ). The best biodynamic growers seem to pick & choose which of the principles work best for their vineyards and not use those that don’t. As you said, they spend a lot of time thinking about the health of their vines and I think that’s a great thing. They tend to be very hygienic in the winery and non-interventional. For instance, Olivier Humbrecht does not add any yeast. He assumes that the best yeast strains for a particular terroir are growing naturally on the grapes that are so well tended to in the vineyards and that those yeast strains will start “spontaneous fermentation” when ready and last for the required time for that particular vineyard’s microclimate/terroir. I think the results from him, Huet, DRC, Joly, and other biodynamic advocates speak for themselves!
Yes, winemakers who care and are hands-on will probably make betters wines, all else equal. But what's to be gained by the magical thinking? It's a waste of time. And it's just wrong, so it shouldn't be encouraged. Wouldn't these people make even better wines if they concentrated their efforts on proven organic techniques rather than on cow horns with cosmic energy? So let's compare apples to apples: Are biodynamic wine grapes better than organic grapes?
If I had the choice between two surgeons, both with seemingly excellent recommendations, but one insisted on placing cow horns around the OR to focus the healing properties of the cosmos on the patient, while the other believed only in proven technology and peer-reviewed science, I know who I'd pick.
I think as time goes on, the biodynamic techniques that work and are quantifiable will remain and everything else will fall away. But we had to start somewhere haha. There were cave drawings before oil on canvas.
It's not one of the producers you mentioned, but sometime in 2018 or 2019, I impulse-bought Domaine des Baumard's Clos du Papillon (dated 2016, I think). I knew nothing about the contrasting Chenin styles of Loire sub-areas at the time, and had probably never heard of Savennières, much less its micro-appelations. I rarely even buy French whites to begin with. But somehow I had a hunch.
It didn't get opened until six months into the pandemic, on an occasion (under otherwise stressful conditions) that marked the first time I'd seen family since the pandemic began. It was life-affirmingly amazing and one of the few highlights of that fraught year.
I've yet to encounter Baumard in a brick-and-mortar again, but by chance I already have that very Domaine aux Moines in my fridge, waiting to be indulged.
That sounds great, and I do know that winery. So you already have the Domaine aux Moines 2019?
The very one. In the fridge, for at least a few months now. I think it was the first Savennières of any sort I'd encountered on a store shelf since that Clos du Papillon. Awaiting summer and/or "the right occasion" and/or the kick-in-the-pants from this post.
This is a great wine that ages really well. If you want a special dessert-styled wine go for their Quarts de Chaume. I had a case of the ‘71 that I finished off around 2015. The bottles that were sound ( it came from a questionable previous owner through auction ) were some of the most sublime sweet wines I’ve ever had!
Wow, thank you for the recommendation! Internet searches (for the Clos du Papillon, at least) tend to suggest their distribution still exists, though Massachusetts makes shipping more complicated than most states so I've never developed an online-ordering habit. Meanwhile, the store where I first bought it closed its urban location during the pandemic; I'm rarely in the suburbs.
But I absolutely already have mapped out Baumard's distance from the Savennières train station, along with a few other producers on both sides of the river, and have nudged that part of the world up the post-COVID travel list. So I'll be adding "investigate their sweet offerings" to my radar.
It’s a great region to visit. Make sure to get to Vouvray & Montlouis ( right across the river from each other ). I’m sure there are some great tasting rooms. Not sure if Huet offers a tour but their cellars are amazing with old vintages to die for just stacked up! Not sure if there’s as much old stock left since the family sold the domaine a whole back. I heard the main interest of the wealthy buyer from Asia was to get his hands on all the old bottles for himself & friends. We were lucky. The legendary Noel Pinguet, son-in-law of the even more legendary Gaston Huet, and winemaker for almost 40 years, spent an entire day with us tasting old vintages, touring vineyards & crawling through the cellars as we had a mutual winemaker friend that is close with both of us and set it up. When the day ended, Noel handed my wife & I over to an assistant and brought us into a special buyer’s room and said to the assistant “they’re cleared to buy anything they want to!” This was in 2007 and vintages back yo the 1920s were staring us in the face!
As I'm sure you can tell, I'm no expert in the region, but my encounters with Vouvray have only been... fine. There really might be some subjective attribute of the one sub-region that speaks to me in a way others won't. But I appreciate the guidance; it's already novel that I'd consider a trip to a white wine-specific area, so of course I'd want to see some breadth of geography and taste some compare-and-contrast.
Today we opened a bottle of Les Vieux Clos 2021 by Famille Joly at Tacoma Wine Merchants. Beautiful!
On Savennieres, specifically Nicolas Joly’s Coulee de Serrant.
I can remember my first (and only) trip to the property with my former wife back in 1992 or 93.
The importer at that time was anxious for someone from Sherry-Lehmann (the OLD Sherry-Lehmann!) to visit the property to give a boost to their sales.
Nicolas was the perfect host, but we got the distinct impression that after a quiet night in Angers we had been transported into another dimension.
The opportunity to taste older vintages removed some of the mystery of that wonderful but challenging wine at its peak, but the most memorable thing about that day were the surroundings.
Normal flowering plants after M. Joly had applied his biodynamic magic were gigantic.
Something right out of Woody Allen’s SLEEPER.
Quite a “trip” back in 92.
Mick Yurch
Congrats on bringing these to your readers attention , if they weren’t already ). Savenieres makes tremendous wines. I’m sure you’ve heard Nicolas Joly speak. He is one of the most passionate winegrowers I’ve ever met. His belief in biodynamic farming is unwavering to say the least.
Yes, I may post some videos I did with him in early 2020.
I'll have to start exploring Loire wines. Great newsletter. However, one thing hits a nerve with me: the “godfather of biodynamic viticulture.” Biodynamics is a fringe, pseudoscientific theory of agriculture invented by a clairvoyant with no farming experience. I can't support anti-science nonsense, and I don't like it being promoted. As Brian Dunning said, "Essentially, we're talking about witchcraft and sorcery being employed as a modern farming tool." I realize that otherwise mentally competent adults can believe in quirky things, but biodynamics should have all our crap detectors pinned in the red. https://skeptoid.com/episodes/4026
Eh, the way I feel about biodynamic farming is that it forces the winegrower to be constantly out in the vineyard and hyperfocused on everything, so that has to be a good thing. So who cares whether they believe in something that other people see as "witchcraft"? As long as they're hands-on in the vineyard and growing organically. Also, I would say the quality-to-duds percentage of biodynamic wines I drink is much higher than conventional farming, so whether or not it's scientifically sound, the people following it often make better wines.
I’ve always said something similar. Biodynamic winemakers spend a lot of time in the vineyard. I’m pretty close friends with Olivier Humbrecht and I’ve never seen a winemaker as conscientious in the vineyards and as hands off in the winery as he is and he puts out great wines of terroir. He’s very scientific in his approach ( like Noel Pinguet was when he had the reigns at Domaine Huet in Vouvray ). The best biodynamic growers seem to pick & choose which of the principles work best for their vineyards and not use those that don’t. As you said, they spend a lot of time thinking about the health of their vines and I think that’s a great thing. They tend to be very hygienic in the winery and non-interventional. For instance, Olivier Humbrecht does not add any yeast. He assumes that the best yeast strains for a particular terroir are growing naturally on the grapes that are so well tended to in the vineyards and that those yeast strains will start “spontaneous fermentation” when ready and last for the required time for that particular vineyard’s microclimate/terroir. I think the results from him, Huet, DRC, Joly, and other biodynamic advocates speak for themselves!
Yes, winemakers who care and are hands-on will probably make betters wines, all else equal. But what's to be gained by the magical thinking? It's a waste of time. And it's just wrong, so it shouldn't be encouraged. Wouldn't these people make even better wines if they concentrated their efforts on proven organic techniques rather than on cow horns with cosmic energy? So let's compare apples to apples: Are biodynamic wine grapes better than organic grapes?
If I had the choice between two surgeons, both with seemingly excellent recommendations, but one insisted on placing cow horns around the OR to focus the healing properties of the cosmos on the patient, while the other believed only in proven technology and peer-reviewed science, I know who I'd pick.
I think as time goes on, the biodynamic techniques that work and are quantifiable will remain and everything else will fall away. But we had to start somewhere haha. There were cave drawings before oil on canvas.